Cibbersicks Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 I was just wondering if anybody here would know what would the smallest battery be that i could use on my track only cbr600rr8? Physically i mean, i.e small dimensions and in weight. Thanks in advance Cibbers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfroem Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 A123 cells check: www.durbahn.de Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 Interesting....big cost though, i wonder if i could make something similar for a lot less? Anyone know what spec these cells are? Edit: found 'em, i reckon I'd need about 5 of these to get the power i need...opinions? Battery Link Cibbers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Do you want to run a starter motor and do you want to keep the charging system? On our project Bros we've a tiny little thing out of an alarm, about the size of a 20 pack of fags, weighs about a kilo and with the charging system in place it'll run all day, but it'll never start the bike. Just have a decent battery there for starting, on jump leads, and then have your tiddley battery for running it. Your little rechargeable batteries in your link; you'd need 4 in series (3.3x4=13.2v, and 9.2Ah, I think, although I'm not 100% sure how you work out the current) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Do you want to run a starter motor and do you want to keep the charging system? On our project Bros we've a tiny little thing out of an alarm, about the size of a 20 pack of fags, weighs about a kilo and with the charging system in place it'll run all day, but it'll never start the bike. Just have a decent battery there for starting, on jump leads, and then have your tiddley battery for running it. Your little rechargeable batteries in your link; you'd need 4 in series (3.3x4=13.2v, and 9.2Ah, I think, although I'm not 100% sure how you work out the current) Yeh i wanna keep the charging system, starter motor etc etc, I'd preferably like a tiny light battery which will still start the bike, and i reckon if i make a pack with like you said 4 of those tiddly ones in the link, i'd get a 'durbhan-esque' battery at a fraction of the cost. There's someone over on the US 600rr.net site doing it, so i'm watching for him to blow his bike up before i do it lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monty_zac Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 I have an RGV250 battery on my track nc30. That uses the electric starter but no lights. Tiny wee thing it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacemonkey Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Yeh i wanna keep the charging system, starter motor etc etc, I'd preferably like a tiny light battery which will still start the bike, and i reckon if i make a pack with like you said 4 of those tiddly ones in the link, i'd get a 'durbhan-esque' battery at a fraction of the cost. There's someone over on the US 600rr.net site doing it, so i'm watching for him to blow his bike up before i do it lol Any chance of posting the link for that thread Cibbersicks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Any chance of posting the link for that thread Cibbersicks? Yeh no worries, bare with the guys on there they are mostly yanks so they takl a lot of crap most of the time Link Link Very Good Link Cibbers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buster Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Your little rechargeable batteries in your link; you'd need 4 in series (3.3x4=13.2v, and 9.2Ah, I think, although I'm not 100% sure how you work out the current) Volts in series multiplies, current in series stays same so you'd end up with a 13.2V battery with 2300mAh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacemonkey Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Yeh no worries, bare with the guys on there they are mostly yanks so they takl a lot of crap most of the time Link Link Very Good Link Cibbers Thanks for that! I'll have a look tonight! Hopefully talked about big apple pies, yum yum........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Volts in series multiplies, current in series stays same so you'd end up with a 13.2V battery with 2300mAh. Yeh i think i'll need 8, i.e. 2 banks of four to get a decent current. Hmmm at £15 per battery now i see why Durbahn is floggin them at so much, cos they ain't cheap. I'm currently looking to see if i can find them any cheaper..... I may just see about fitting a YTX4 because its small, cheap and relatively light..... However, China seem to have a lot of cheapy ones.... are they any good though? eBay Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonniB Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 The durbahn battery is well worth the money, I run a 2.3Ah one, has juice enough for 25-30 starts on my NC30 before going flat. A newer bike with fuel injection would need the 4.6Ah one, but at 650g that is very light and small. Don't bother with crappy cheap ones. Buy cheap, buy twice... Ronni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porter_jamie Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 what size do you reckon i need for the mono - one fuel pump (maybe 5amps?), one wideband lambda with heater (3amps) and dash/logger/ecu (1 amp total) one coil and one injector. i plan to run an alternator still. no electric start and no lights or other nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonniB Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Well, my bike uses about 15Amps all in all, and that's doing fine on the 2.3Ah. So you should be fine with something like because you don't have to start it from the battery. Ronni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porter_jamie Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Well, my bike uses about 15Amps all in all, and that's doing fine on the 2.3Ah. So you should be fine with something like because you don't have to start it from the battery. Ronni thanks, i think that might be the way to go maybe i should measure the amps when it is running to make sure. anyone care to explain the best way of doing this without killing myself, or the bike?!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scwirral Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 thanks, i think that might be the way to go maybe i should measure the amps when it is running to make sure. anyone care to explain the best way of doing this without killing myself, or the bike?!! That wont be an easy thing to do. You have to put the meter in series with the battery, ie it becomes part of the circuit. If you want to start the bike with the meter in series, you're gonna need a very clever meter or you are gonna have to do some cunning work setting up a hight power shunt resistor so that most of the current passes through that and not through the meter. You'll then have to do some calculations to adjust the meter reading. I think the easiest thing to do would be to bump start the bike (so that you don't draw starting current with the meter in series), but you are still gonna probably need a pretty hefty meter as the running bike could still draw quite a lot of current. You need to have at least a rough idea of the maximum current you expect so that you can be sure that your meter is man enough (or at least you can put in an inline fuse rated at less than Imax for the meter. You are unlikely to damage the bike, but there is a very large chance that you'll fuck up the ammeter if you don't know what you are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacemonkey Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 The durbahn battery is well worth the money, I run a 2.3Ah one, has juice enough for 25-30 starts on my NC30 before going flat. A newer bike with fuel injection would need the 4.6Ah one, but at 650g that is very light and small. Don't bother with crappy cheap ones. Buy cheap, buy twice... Ronni Yeah but could you really give Durbahn money after reading this thread? http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?t=199743&page=4 What is his issue? He gooes to the trouble of reading the thread, gets grumpy and then refuses to explain..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 I've scrapped the idea of making a cell pack, it just seemed like an over expensive way of saving a few pounds. I went for this instead today: It's a YTX4 LBS and it's tiny. Its just about 1/2 the size/weight of the standard battery, and cost me £13.00 It weighs just under 1kg, as opposed to the house brick-esque weight of the standard battery. If i made a pack from those cells, it would weigh around 600grams in total, and i'm afraid £50 odd quids difference between the pack and the YTX4 just does it for me. As for the YTX4 weighing around 400grams more than the pack, I'll just have a dump before i go on track......... Cibbers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Using Lipo batteries has a few issues with charging as well.. Lipo's need a specific charger and they do not turn off when the batteries are charged.. They keep putting power into them and they first swell with the heat and then can just burst into flames. I think there are some chargers which can measure the level of charge but they are really expensive..... They do need charging as the bike will only keep them at about 80% charged and if they are not discharged from time to time to condition the batteries they can die on you in quite a short period of time... They are OK for trackday and race use if you keep topping them up between sessions and condition them correctly but they are not a fit and forget part like a lead acid battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intra Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 There is this option as well as the Durbahn one as well. http://www.carbon-speed.com/prod.htm You will need a voltage regulator off an RC car though. They are super accurate compared to the shit fitted to most bikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heds954 Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Yeh i wanna keep the charging system, starter motor etc etc, I'd preferably like a tiny light battery which will still start the bike, and i reckon if i make a pack with like you said 4 of those tiddly ones in the link, i'd get a 'durbhan-esque' battery at a fraction of the cost. There's someone over on the US 600rr.net site doing it, so i'm watching for him to blow his bike up before i do it lol I haven't been* on there for a while... *lurked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Using Lipo batteries has a few issues with charging as well.. Lipo's need a specific charger and they do not turn off when the batteries are charged.. They keep putting power into them and they first swell with the heat and then can just burst into flames. I think there are some chargers which can measure the level of charge but they are really expensive..... They do need charging as the bike will only keep them at about 80% charged and if they are not discharged from time to time to condition the batteries they can die on you in quite a short period of time... They are OK for trackday and race use if you keep topping them up between sessions and condition them correctly but they are not a fit and forget part like a lead acid battery. Quite right. And one more complication: When you make a pack with LiPo or LiIon batteries in series, you need an extra balancing circuit to make sure that each battery is charged to the same maximum voltage (usually 4.1 or 4.2V). If you don't have that, some batteries in the pack will be charged to a higher voltage than others, shortening their life span. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2009 I haven't been* on there for a while... *lurked Yeh I mainly lurk on there to be honest. I don't think they take kindly to guys from the UK unless you have a million trillion £££ spent on LED's, Marchesinis and gear indicators.... here is a quick taster folks of what the regular clientele is like over on 600rr.net: "Duuuuur Fred? Duuuur Whats This Fred?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majik Posted June 24, 2009 Report Share Posted June 24, 2009 I've scrapped the idea of making a cell pack, it just seemed like an over expensive way of saving a few pounds. I went for this instead today: It's a YTX4 LBS and it's tiny. Its just about 1/2 the size/weight of the standard battery, and cost me £13.00 It weighs just under 1kg, as opposed to the house brick-esque weight of the standard battery. Cibbers Sorry for jumping in here - but this could well solve a problem I have. Firstly - £13 from where? Online or local bike shop? Secondly, I'm rebuilding my Goose, and relocating the battery, but it's a huge bugger (ytx-12bs). The engine is from a dr350s (electric start) which uses the YTX-4 LBS already mentioned, which would fit perfectly under the seat (where I want to relocate it). The CCA difference in the batteries is pretty big, but what am I risking by going with a smaller battery here? Is it purely less cranks on the starter button? Cheers, Majik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted June 24, 2009 Report Share Posted June 24, 2009 Unless I'm completely mistaken, the only part you need to worry about with regards the current a battery can put out is the starter motor, if your bike is keeping its charging ciruit. If a battery was having to supply its own current, rather than that of the generator of the bike, then your battery would run flat at one point or another, and hopefully, it doesn't. The only other consideration is that it can pass sufficient current from the generator through the battery, while the bike's running. So, for people like with a kick start and a daylight MOT (or just small bulbs on their headlights) then a teeny weeny battery would be absolutley fine, so long as it's 12v. If you're running a starter, then either have a battery that's big enough to start it, or if it's a trackbike or something, simply have a decent sized battery there on jump leads, then use your teeny weeny battery on the bike once it's going. If it's not a track bike, then a bigger battery, probably something about 7Ah will do on more or less anything that needs proper starting current. I had a 7Ah battery on my VFR, which was fuel injected, and that'd turn it over about 4 or 5 times at 30 seconds a go without any trouble. Any more then it starts suffering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted June 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2009 Firstly - £13 from where? Online or local bike shop? Cheers, Majik Sorry should have said, thats a trade price, i bought it through work. I'm not sure what these little buggers retail at though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacemonkey Posted June 24, 2009 Report Share Posted June 24, 2009 Not quite, it also depends on the output of the alternator and the manner in which the regulator dumps excess voltage. The real solution would be for someone to produce a charging circuit specifically for the lithium thingamy batteries that would safely charge them, plust keep them balanced. I might try building a pack but if I experiment I'll make sure they are in some kind of fireproof container, vented away from me! Do we have any electronics whiz types on here that might be interested in producing a better charging system circuit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porter_jamie Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 just ordered a couple of batteries and a charger of durbahn, will let you know what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porter_jamie Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 still waiting.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibbersicks Posted July 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 still waiting.... He's currently lying on his workshop floor surrounded by Heineken bottles.... he will be with you soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.