exuprob Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 Decided, due to still having rough running problems with the R1, to check the valve clearances so locked myself away for a couple of hours yesterday and stripped the old thing down. Found that theyre all tight, best exhaust was .25mm which is within spec but tightest was .18mm which isnt but its the inlets that have really tightened up, no.1 cyl had 2 of the 3 valves under .08mm, worst was .06mm. Would it make the bike run rough with clearances this tight?? Bikes covered 20k or so. Ive jotted down all the clearances and then removed the cams and noted the shim sizes but some have really odd sizes like 189 and 191 whereas in the owners manual the shims all seem to be sized in increments of 5 ie 175, 180 etc. Do I just round that to the closest? Ill run through the tables and sort out what I'll need, I might stick them on here so as to do a double check as well. Now Im wondering if I should whip the head off as Im this far in...................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Discosef Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 Yes the bike will run rough with out of spec clearances. I usually try and get the clearance to the center of the spec even if the the valve is'nt out. Yes just round up the shim to the closest. Don't know what the interval is on your bike but on my Kawasaki it needs checking every 10K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronenige Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 Set you inlets near the max , it will make it run shite ( ish ) and make it harder to start , add the thickness of the shim to the gap you have then deduct the gap you want will give you the thickness you require , leave the head alone at this stage , just do your valves and try it personally if the valves go tight I set them at the top end if they go big set them at the bottom end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Smoke Posted December 26, 2013 Report Share Posted December 26, 2013 I usually cheat with valve clearances, and get the shims surface ground to size. Saves buying new ones for sure, aand if you find someone who will do the job for beer/biscuits, you're laughing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted December 28, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2013 Oooo, didnt know you could do that. I need 18 new shims (I'll post up my working out so I can get a double check from someone thats done it before) so Ill need to buy a few. I have heard that the shims can be traded in for the new ones too but haven't looked into this otherwise its £2.50 per shim! Any ideas on this bit or is it Yamaha main dealer??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronenige Posted December 28, 2013 Report Share Posted December 28, 2013 £2.50 per shim is cheap , I assume that is exchange ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted December 28, 2013 Report Share Posted December 28, 2013 Quick question - if you grind the shims, don't you lose any hardening causing them to wear out much quicker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilchicken0 Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 If you put the ground surface upwards its covered by the cam follower so its not in contact with any wearing surface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Smoke Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 If you put the ground surface upwards its covered by the cam follower so its not in contact with any wearing surface. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted January 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2014 Ok, finally got Christmas (drinking) out of the way so here goes.... Valve clearances and what I think i need. cyl 1 clearance inlets .07 .10 .09 cyl 2 .10 .09 .10 cyl 3 .13 .10 .13 cyl 4 .14 .14 .13 shim fitted 192 196 194 188 190 191 191 189 190 189 189 191 shim needed 180 190 190 185 185 185 185 185 185 185 185 189 cyl 1 cleance exh .18 .20 cyl 2 .20 .20 cyl 3 .25 .25 cyl 4 .23 .22 shim fitted 188 188 188 186 184 186 185 185 shim needed 185 185 185 180 bloody hell!!! 180 180 inlet clearance min .11 max .20 exh clearance min .21 max .30 all in mm Some of these are over minimum but only just so opening them up is not a bad shout in my book. Can anyone check Ive got this somewhere close and confirm which can be swapped and what shims I actually need? Cheers in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilchicken0 Posted January 11, 2014 Report Share Posted January 11, 2014 I'd leave No4 inlets and the two 1.3 on No.3 You'll have a couple of 189's so they can go in No1 inlets That's if you want to save a (small) amount of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted January 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 Ok, heres what I think i need; 8x185 4x180 The rest I can swap about with what I have. Can someone make sure I haven't cocked up? Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilchicken0 Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 looks ok - check with the minimum / maximum tollerance feeler gauges once it's all together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted January 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2014 Will do, got shims at £2 each and they've now shown up so no excuse not to get on with it now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyJim Posted January 16, 2014 Report Share Posted January 16, 2014 some handy hints from me, in case you've not adjusted the clearances before* before you remove the cams, cable tie the cam chain to the cam sprockets. then, once the carriers are unbolted, you can lift the cams up out of the way to access the bucket & shims, without having to re-set the cam timing at the end of it all get a magnet on a stick - this is the one I have and it's the perfect size - which allows you to lift the bucket out of the recess in the head. As if by magic (well, magnetism) the shim will come out at the same time, as it will stick to the underside of the bucket http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_778655_langId_-1_categoryId_165469 also, replace the O-rings on the coolant pipes which run through the valve cover and make sure you grease up the bolts that hold the pipes to the cover, they're a bugger for corroding. *edit to add pics and say sorry if I'm telling you how to suck eggs etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted January 18, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Great advice MonkeyJim. I did the clearances on an old FZR exup so had a vague idea on how to do it on the R1 but had the back up of a mate with the FZR that had done it before so this is first time on my own Using cable ties would have been a great shout but the cams are already out on the bench so the horse has already bolted on that one! Yep, got my magnet on a stick already, I couldn't work out another way of doing it. Just need a 3/8 torque wrench as my 1/2 one starts at 20 ftlbs. Good shout with the O rings though, I'd forgotten all about them. The bolts came out ok but the pipes themselves needed some proper wriggling before they let go. I'll get the shims swapped, cams back in and timed up and check the clearances tomorrow.......maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilchicken0 Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 A 1/4" torque wrench might be better - I got a Teng recently it goes down to 5nm which is good for the clutch on my fzr400. My can bolts are 10nm and are the same part as the R1 .... 8mm socket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Gave this a good go yesterday afternoon. Swapped all the shims, cams back in and timed up, turned the engine over a couple of times and found the inlet cam was a tooth out so sorted that, turned the engine over again (by hand obviously) and it made a horrible noise...slight panic until I noticed a cable tie doing a Spokey Dokey impression on one of the cam wheels! So, checked the clearances and theyre all well within spec, cam cover on. Hopefully thats job jobbed, just carbs, airbox etc to go and I can hit the button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilchicken0 Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Your carbs could probably do with balancing now - the inlet valves are opening a fraction more so they'll draw different amouts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted January 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Yep, thats my next job. The wifes out having her hair done tonight so I'll bring them in the house and do the static balance to get them in the ball park then hook up the gauges once theyre back on the bike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronenige Posted February 22, 2014 Report Share Posted February 22, 2014 c'mon then , did it sort your problem ?????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exuprob Posted February 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 In a word......No. All valve clearances are now within tolerance and fitted new plugs too, put everything back together and it made not a bit of difference! Bike is still very lumpy at idle and with very small throttle openings its still cant decide wether to accelerate or not but open the throttle a fraction further and its fine. Ive got some spare coils so rigged another set of these up so I can test the electrical side of things and it made no difference either. Checked compression and there is less than 5 psi difference across all four cylinders. I thought it maybe carbs blocked so sent them off and had them stripped and ultrasonically cleaned (and they came back looking like new!) and the bike is just the same. It feels as though the pilot/idle circuit is blocked to me but might be wrong. Next step.....dunno. Was thinking that I might invest in another, know good set of carbs and see if that does any good. Unfortunately the kit car boys love these 40mm carbs for their cars so the price is around £200 for a used set but at least I could buy them, fit them and if they make no difference sell them on again I suppose. At a bit of a loss really.......I'd rather I'd blown the bloody thing up as at least Id know which direction to go in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyJim Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 frustrating. sorry the woes continue. might be clutching at straws here but..... exup valve maybe? could be exhaust rather than intake related ie valve staying closed or not opening properly? I have no idea really, other than to suggest you bin the standard exhaust & fit a full system you know it makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted March 1, 2014 Report Share Posted March 1, 2014 Do they wear the emulsion tubes oval like the FZRs do? Could be worth a look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronenige Posted March 1, 2014 Report Share Posted March 1, 2014 Do they wear the emulsion tubes oval like the FZRs do? Could be worth a look. we're on the same page fella http://pbmagforum.co.uk/index.php?/topic/46501-r1-carburation-all-gone-to-shit/page-2#entry967287 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_H Posted October 4, 2014 Report Share Posted October 4, 2014 Sorry to dig this up, where did you get the shims for £2? I've got quite a few to purchase! Did you ever get to the bottom of your problem btw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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