vfiend Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Hello All, I've been procrastinating actually working on my new house and designing my new shed and layout instead. It's an unfortunately small space - appx 4.6x2.4 internally, just enough to fit 3 bikes and work I hope with the correct arrangement. Here's a rough plan view: Bench for working, welding and general fab, 2x pull around tool cabinets so I can get them out easily for racing. Probable put some shelving along the wall to the left - got to get bikes in and see how much clearance there is first though. Seating area for plotting out the next step or watching movies out the way, general chill space. I'm thinking of putting the roof slope the other way round, its not a big garden by any stretch of the imagination and hopefully less of a front projection will make it less imposing, it also makes the guttering more easily accessible. There will be a clear single apex roof over the decked area between the back-most room and the shed - so i'll be able to get in to the workshop without getting wet Obviously the shed will have doors, I will steel reinforce some basic multi-light french doors for each opening with a heavy duty shrouded van hasp for security. The grass leading up will be artificial, i've got some samples which are quite nice and know a few people with full gardens in it who are very happy - will hopefully withstand big dirty motorbikes being wheeled around on it. So, any suggestions from knowledgable forum types? Anybody custom made their own shed from scratch? It's my preferred way forward as I can make it the right size and more robust than off the shelf sheds. Please feel free to photo-whore if you have useful layout or construction examples EDIT Here's a picture of before while I was working on the old coal shed: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacemonkey Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Can you fit some kind of canopy at the front? Even if only the sort of thing you find on a shop front? You're gonna have to push bikes out to get at the one you wanna work on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 30, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 The space on the RH side is the work side - it should just be the race bike in here normally. The left is intended for parking only - of course it will be a game of tetris re-arranging to get the other bikes into the workshop area. (I'll proabaly just do my chain tensioning etc on the paved section by the gate / kitchen on the other side of the grass) There will be covered clear plastic roof section between the shed and the back of the house to the right - this'll keep one side more dry and keep me dry when walking to the garage (patio doors on the end of that room - the model shows 2 openings side-by-side because I can't be bothered to model patio doors). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahatma Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 That looks stellar.Only suggestion from me would be make it a bit wider as it looks abit crampy from those pictures.But guess you're stuck with the fixed space from the sound of it. Congrats on your new project.Maybe build a timemachine and start it last fall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 30, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 That looks stellar.Only suggestion from me would be make it a bit wider as it looks abit crampy from those pictures.But guess you're stuck with the fixed space from the sound of it. Congrats on your new project.Maybe build a timemachine and start it last fall Yeah definately tight on space, an extra half a meter either way would have made it positively luxurious, But then again it's likely to be preferential to the current 2-wheeled abode: ^i wish it were still this tidy (!) I literally have to climb to get into the workspace and even then it's too cramped. I've just had a genius idea to give me more working space... edit: i forgot it, bugger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Is it a walled garden or is that wall just there for drawing purpose?, I would be thinking of creating more space by incorperating the rear and walls of the shed as part of the garden wall if indeed the wall is there.. can I ask why you have 2 seats there too, surely those will take up valuable space?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thefatman Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Stack those two bikes up one top of each other in the corner, lots more space that way. Stick a hoist in above, then have a movable table strong enough to take a bike and tall enough to fit over the other bike. Lift bike up, slide table in underneath, lower bike on to table then push the second bike underneath that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahatma Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Yeah definately tight on space, an extra half a meter either way would have made it positively luxurious, But then again it's likely to be preferential to the current 2-wheeled abode: ^i wish it were still this tidy (!) I literally have to climb to get into the workspace and even then it's too cramped. I've just had a genius idea to give me more working space... Sell one bike?.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 30, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Is it a walled garden or is that wall just there for drawing purpose? ... can I ask why you have 2 seats there too, surely those will take up valuable space?. It IS a walled garden, the wall with the property I'm joined to (Semi, fnarr) is only single brick, but the other 2 are double brick, the wall to the back is 2.2m high, so I could have a shallow pitch coming down from it making the roof almost flat - that'd give me another foot of depth. The only trouble is insulation and damp, the walls are 120 years old and they spew damp in the winter. I'm very tempted to use the (fabricated shed) side walls to support a beam across the back so that the rear wall isn't supporting; it's got a bit of a lean on it so I don't want to vertically load it, but I could attach the uprights to it, may even support the wall a bit. The two seats represent a double van seat which will be going in, got to have something comfy for thinking through problems or just chilling out Stack those two bikes up one top of each other in the corner, lots more space that way. ... I want to be able to stroll in in the morning and pick which steed will take me to work, stacking bikes sounds like a disaster waiting to happen, I like the out of the box thinking though. Your fantastic hospital bed will be much used too (not currently modelled) Sell one bike?.... I wanted 4 bikes in there 3 is already a compromise - I do have storage else where about a 5 minute walk from the house in my dad's workshop, but its not immensely convinient. The plan is to have 2x commuter/toy bikes and the race bike, i'd like it to be as self sufficient a garage as possible - being able to do any job in there (bar fitting tyres, I can't be arsed with that). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted March 30, 2013 Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Would it work out bigger if you made it as an extension to your office instead of across the bottom of the garden as a stand alone unit?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 30, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2013 Would it work out bigger if you made it as an extension to your office instead of across the bottom of the garden as a stand alone unit?. Alas this was considered, if it were either of the houses next door it'd work a treat (because of the inverted layout of the semi), but to do that in this garden would block all the light coming in and it'd be all very dark - i know this because my grandparents live 2 doors down and did a very similar thing. (That's why I bought the place, they're not getting and younger and it'd be nice to be nearby to help out) The shed across the bottom leaves a window though which there is actually some sun - it doesn't block much as there is a 2.2m wall at the bottom of the garden anyway. (I've even done shadow tests with big bits of wood, i'm a sad bastard). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 I know I have said it before but i still think the the 2 seats are eating up valuable floor space, have you thought about wall mounted fold down or hinged seating that could be folded up out the way to free up that space when working on your bikes, In my wee shed, it is 10x8 feet I use a folding garden chair for seating and if i'm needing more work area I fold it down and stick it up in the rafters out the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 I think the seats are modelled larger than they actually are, it'll only be a set of double seats out of a van. I like the idea of the folding seats, or more so the idea of being able to move the seats out the way. I could put the seats on castors and roll them to the other side / around 90 degrees, I think that'd work. As a permenant feature they are certainly in the way and there is no reason against mounting on castors. I'd really like the seats in, it just adds that small element of luxury into what will be a reasonably basic shed. Off on a tangent it's handy this, it's weird the decisions you make and then effectively shut the door on the alternatives. I think not building upto and against the 3 existing walls would be a waste - the extra space would make it much more practical. I suppose I can always bitmumen paint the wall first and put 25mm polystyrene under the capp overhangs and build the wall upto that either side, it'd give me another 2' on the width. Using the existing back wall is probably a must too as it gives me back the clearance gap and the wall thickness, so nearly 2' depth! Although I'd consider most of my ideas to be well thought through, I'll readily admit some are just daft. (I don't want to be that guy who asks advice and ignores it all...) FIRST POST EDITED FOR 'BEFORE' IMAGE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccubed Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 Live in the shed and make the house your workshop. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidkinky Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 Are you locked in to the design, height wise? Mezzanine level FTMFW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 Are you locked in to the design, height wise? Mezzanine level FTMFW. Haha, that'd be cool. Building regs 'permitted development' allows 2.5m max. The back wall is about 2.2 / 2.3m (i'll measure it today). If I have the pitch running down from that it lowers the overall height a little more and means there is less pitch so it'll need to be a little beafier. The upside to pitching it this way is that it'll block less light and be less imposing on the garden (opposite pitch to the 3d images). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexp5 Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 My garage is 4.5m x 2.5m internally and it really isn't a lot of space to play in. I currently have four bikes shoehorned in and to work comfortably on one of them means moving two outside. It's even better if three of them are out of the way - it fucking hurts when trying to shuffle past the Mrs SV and taking a jab off a clutch lever to the ribs. It's like some nightmarish game of motorcycle Tetris if I need to get something from under the workbench. Just saying, like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bravecat Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 My garage is 4.5m x 2.5m internally and it really isn't a lot of space to play in. I currently have four bikes shoehorned in and to work comfortably on one of them means moving two outside. It's even better if three of them are out of the way - it fucking hurts when trying to shuffle past the Mrs SV and taking a jab off a clutch lever to the ribs. It's like some nightmarish game of motorcycle Tetris if I need to get something from under the workbench. Just saying, like... So True, if you just want somewhere to park up your plans look good, but for a workshop it will start to annoy you in no time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexp5 Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 So True, if you just want somewhere to park up your plans look good, but for a workshop it will start to annoy you in no time. Bearing in mind my garage is a normal single with an up & over door at the front - I do like vfiend's plans. The two doors will make moving stuff out of the way a lot easier but a canopy to keep them under cover outside while you fettle on one inside would be on my list. And believe me - you will want to move them out of the way. For instance - just removing the tank / bodywork / rear wheel off my Fazer requires a surprising amount of room to be able to work in comfort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 I think the seats are modelled larger than they actually are, it'll only be a set of double seats out of a van. I like the idea of the folding seats, or more so the idea of being able to move the seats out the way. I could put the seats on castors and roll them to the other side / around 90 degrees, I think that'd work. As a permenant feature they are certainly in the way and there is no reason against mounting on castors. I'd really like the seats in, it just adds that small element of luxury into what will be a reasonably basic shed. Off on a tangent it's handy this, it's weird the decisions you make and then effectively shut the door on the alternatives. I think not building upto and against the 3 existing walls would be a waste - the extra space would make it much more practical. I suppose I can always bitmumen paint the wall first and put 25mm polystyrene under the capp overhangs and build the wall upto that either side, it'd give me another 2' on the width. Using the existing back wall is probably a must too as it gives me back the clearance gap and the wall thickness, so nearly 2' depth! Although I'd consider most of my ideas to be well thought through, I'll readily admit some are just daft. (I don't want to be that guy who asks advice and ignores it all...) FIRST POST EDITED FOR 'BEFORE' IMAGE. Isnt there such a thing as castors for bikes?, would be bloody handy that if you could just wheel them around the floor space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanerno1 Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 It's like some nightmarish game of motorcycle Tetris if I need to get something from under the workbench. Just saying, like... Mine was like that lol And to the op, you have neglected a few essentials, beer fridge, stereo, comfy chair, heating, dancing pole etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexp5 Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 Isnt there such a thing as castors for bikes?, would be bloody handy that if you could just wheel them around the floor space. Yeah. Usually called a Moto mover or something. Not very elegant, is it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 There is this one to, looks as if it could be a handy bit of kit.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted March 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 And to the op, you have neglected a few essentials, beer fridge, stereo, comfy chair, heating, dancing pole etc.. Beer Fridge - check, Stereo - check, Comfy Chair - somewhere near with van seat, Heating - Oil filled electric radiator and well insulated roof, Dancing pole - now theres and idea! (although i'm not sure there is enough room in there to swing the proverbial dead cat, let along my leggy lady, the bedroom perhaps...) I'll be sure to have a nakid lady poster on the shed wall as a substitute - anyone know anywhere that does midget scatt porn calendars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bravecat Posted March 31, 2013 Report Share Posted March 31, 2013 Bearing in mind my garage is a normal single with an up & over door at the front - I do like vfiend's plans. The two doors will make moving stuff out of the way a lot easier but a canopy to keep them under cover outside while you fettle on one inside would be on my list. And believe me - you will want to move them out of the way. For instance - just removing the tank / bodywork / rear wheel off my Fazer requires a surprising amount of room to be able to work in comfort. Agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted April 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2013 Revised plans now include building up to the existing border walls, after seeing the difference back to back it's quite clear - just work-out a way of damp proofing against the bricks leaching moisture. Revised models, lots more space Simple rearrange of seating / tool cab opens some further room too. Also with extended depth it allows fitment of shelving behind the parking area, it may even be possible to squeeze in another bike Anyone got any good good for damp proofing in this situation? My current plan involves: Bitumen paint the wall, plastic damp membrane, 25mm insulation and then build from block as per usual. (built onto a concrete slab of course) Hmmm... Luxurious space... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted April 2, 2013 Report Share Posted April 2, 2013 Personally, I would take the walls down and build new..walls that old must be weak because of age and weather?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducsenna Posted April 2, 2013 Report Share Posted April 2, 2013 Looks great, what CAD programme is that ? Is there a freeware version? I have garage issues it would be good to play with. Can you wall mount the tool cabinets for extra floor space? Most small spaces seem to use the height for good use. A hydraulic bench too maybe, lifting bikes higher means they can sit closer together too? Seats that fold down from the wall for me? Like the back of modern 4wd's maybe? Good work ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanWinkle Posted April 2, 2013 Report Share Posted April 2, 2013 Looks like google sketchup to me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfiend Posted April 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2013 what CAD programme is that ? Is there a freeware version? I have garage issues it would be good to play with. It's Google sketch-up, free from tinterweb. I'm used to pro stuff at work so it seemed a little clunky to begin with, but its fantastic for free. Just watch some tutorial video's before you play and it's a piece.of piss to find your way around the software. For free it's bloody fantastic It's been really handy for visualising things, putting a thread on here and garagejournal has challenged a few things I 'knew' I was going to, more eyes is always a good thing. Can you wall mount the tool cabinets for extra floor space? The plan with rolling cabinets is that I can wheel them up my alley (fnarr) and straight in the van when I'm off racing. Most small spaces seem to use the height for good use. After the roof redesign there limited overhead space, the shelving behind the bike parking should hold plenty though. A hydraulic bench too maybe I have an old hydraulic pump-up hospital bed which will serve this purpose, less crouching should be good for the knees and means less clearance is needed. Seats that fold down from the wall for me? Like the back of modern 4wd's maybe? The new plan is the seat on castors so it can be moved out of the way, or even dragged into the garden and used for other purposes. Looks like google sketchup to me.. Ding ding ding ding ding, we have a winner(!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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