lorenzo Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 So, I've got this little NC30 for my commute to work. KNowing that they're a bit prone to overheating, and because I had to faff about with the exhaust, I took the rads off, flushed them out, tried to straighten some of the fins a bit too, and then refilled the system when I was done with some anti-freeze and a spot of 'waterwetter' that I had knocking about. I then started riding the bloody thing and found that it takes an eternity for it to even register on the temp guage, it never goes about about 75-80ish on there irrespective of what sort of riding I'm doing although I've yet to get stuck in mega heavy traffic (filtering y'see; why sit in traffic?) and the fan's never kicked in either. I'm making a guess here but I don't think it's got a thermostat in there. I had a look on wemoto, and then googled too, and I can't for the life of me see anywhere that does them. i could go to honda of course, they might be able to help, but I'd quite like to have a bit of a tinker and get one that opens a bit sooner than stock; even though my bike's running cool at the moment, if every man and his dog say these bikes can get a bit hot, then it's fair to assume that mine too is going to get a bit hot at some point. Anybody firstly know where i could get one from, or even better, does anybody know anything about thermostat part codes? I bet, in the same way as you can suss out the temp range of a spark plug for example, I could find a thermostat that's the same size but opens a bit cooler than stock? OK PB folks, hit me with your wisdom.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudgetBoy Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 http://www.davidsilverspares.co.uk/VFR400-NC30-(JAPANESE)/part_22837/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 Well, that's a start, thanks. A quick google shows that the part number is common over a number of bikes, a VFR750FV, a CBR600H and a CBR900RRP. So then that brings me on to the next part of it, does anybody know where I can get a cooler thermostat for any of these bikes? Edit: Further googlism has produced this little list. I would still like a cooler one though... Actually, does anybody have a stock one off any of these bikes that they'd care to have a look at for me? That way I could perhaps have a compare with the part code that's stamped onto the side of it (ie the standard part number that's used by the whole thermostat industry, rather than hondas own part number). That way I can perhaps extrapolate the opening temperature and try to find a lower one. All of this is inspired by an old astra I used to have that would overheat with alarming regularity, and pop hoses off, gushing steam just at the moment the fan had just come on. I swapped the fan switch and thermostat to one off a chevette, after spending too long in a car spares place comparing things. Everything was the same size it's just that the temperatures that they started doing things at were all a bit lower. Consequently it always ran about 10% cooler than standard and the fan came on nice and early too. Job solved... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_H Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 Should you not pop the thermostat cover first and see what you've got (or not), then go from there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudgetBoy Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 LOZ,, just had a thought.. are you sure you dont have a faulty temp switch? often overlooked.. http://www.wemoto.com/bikes/Honda/VFR_400_R3L_R3M_NC30_Europe/90-91/picture/Thermo_Switch_for_Temperature_Gauge/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 Both points are valid, I'm guessing it's got no 'stat simply because it's an ex-race bike and as such probably won't have one! I could drain the coolant, check for a stat, refill it, order a stat, then drain it again, fit the stat, then refill it. But you know, I'm a bit too lazy for all of that. I'll have a look in the manual to see if I can check the gauge and/or sender though. I do think it's running cool though as I've never heard the fan come on either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudgetBoy Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 If its an ex race bike it might not have a thermostat in it then. Id have a butchers if i were you mate. Could explain why its running cooler. 80 degrees is also when the thermostat starts to open on your bike.. and its fully open at 90 degrees.So my guess is you dont have one in your bike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blow_away Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Loz, does your bike have an extra switch to run the fan on the rad? If it doesn't, then I'm guessing that you still have a thermostat, as racers commonly had the extra switch fitted if the 'stat had been removed. If you are still concerned about low coolant temperature, you could try taping over a portion of the radiator to see if the temperature gauge rises. You need to check that the temp gauge is not faulty as well. But personally, if the bike is running well I would not worry about it too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 It's not running great, quite wooly for about the first 10 minutes, as if it's a bit cold, and seeing as my journey tends to take about 15 mins if the traffic's good, then 10 mins of it being cold is a bit crap to be honest. Anyway, I've been doing some thinking, because I'm really clever and stuff. The part number is the same on early cbr600's, cbf600's and early blades. All of these bikes have got a more powerful version that's essentially the same engine. I'm guessing that the pokier version of these engines is made by having a higher rev limit and a bit more advance on the ignition (and a few more cc in the blades case), all of which create heat. Therefore, budgetboy, using your encyclopaedic knowledge, could you tell me what the opening temp etc is for the later blade (918 type, I guess about a '97) and also a cbr600 of the same sort of age please, and see if they're slightly lower than than earlier bikes. If the two share a part number then it's fairly safe to assume that they are the same shape and size as the earlier bikes (and hence will fit mine) but perhaps their temperatures a touch lower. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanerno1 Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 The overheating issue is usually from poor condition of the rads etc,, but that said if your running coolant I doubt you'd overheat a nc30 on the road.. On track however they're a mare, especially as the air feed is through the top rad, hot carbs breathing hot air into a overheating engine.. Awesomeness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Are the Jap bikes any worse than UK bikes as mine's got the oil cooler (it's a UK bike y'see, because I'm a bit posh). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanerno1 Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 To my knowledge the grey/uk bikes have the same rads, you could argue that the uk bike would've seen more rain/salt etc but internally I wouldn't have thought there would be much difference,, odd that its a uk spec ex race bike, I thought the uk bikes were much sought after and cherished Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 This has not been cherished, lol. UK clocks, oil cooler, V5 from '91 and all MOTs until a gap at about '03 (which is when it went racing I guess). It's obviously had some love in its life, it's got a FSH until about '99, but in '97 & '98 some guy did about 80% of its total milage, about 20,000 miles, after which I can only assume his back and/or knees gave in! Since the mid 00's it's had a string of new riders use it as their cheap first bike for a year or so then move it on, it just needs a bit of TLC to bring it back from the brink, starting with getting it up to temperature... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudgetBoy Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Loz, i have a 1996 cbr 900 on my pc.. the opening temp on these is 80-84 degrees it starts to open.Fully open at 95 degrees This is the same as your little 400 mate. Normally the opening temp is stamped on the thermostat itself, but not always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanerno1 Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Lol,, you don't need to drain it to check for a stat, just unbolt the top rand and hold it lower down, leave the rad cap on and you should be able to remove the stat housing and only loose a few ml of coolant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Looks like I've got a job for the weekend then, cheers folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 The plot thickens, there's an almost brand new looking 'stat in there, despite the generally crusty look to the housing the bolts came out OK, so clearly somebody's thought about this problem before me. The guage responds OK to the check in the haynes, which is just a 'does it work' rather than 'is is calibrated', so I'll have to just trust it. The sensor's the next thing to check I suppose, make sure that's within spec, and if so, then I'll simply assume the gauge is off. There's a fresh set of plugs going in just for peace of mind, and then if the cold wooliness continues then I'll start pulling the carbs apart (which I don't want to do because they're nigh on impossible to get off). Cheers for your help people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porter_jamie Posted October 13, 2012 Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 my shitty volt meter came with a plug in thermocouple which has a 3 foot long wire. if you could get hold of a similar one, could you push the end under a hose somewhere and see what the temp is doing versus the gauge. just fire the bike up and let it warm up until the fan comes on. that would give you an idea? as for the carbs, i borrowed one off a mate once which wouldnt fire up on all 4 for ages and i made the mistake of trying to fix it, if you think taking the carbs off is a tricky job, try putting the bastards back on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudgetBoy Posted October 13, 2012 Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 I still think you need one of these. You say the bike does not get hot enough and the fan does not kick in. Well you say you have tested the coolant temp gauge and this is ok.. So if the fan works (i gather you have tested this) then you are left with bad earth,bad fan switch or faulty temp sender unit. The green wire on the temp sender goes direct to the temp gauge,there is a green/black tracer that goes off to the Fan switch.So if the temp is not hot enough the fan wont work.See if you can borrow one that work to test.. or get one. * Make sure your fan works 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 OK, for some reason I didn't even touch the temp sender (and so far I've not checked the fan), that's a job for another day. Instead I got distracted by the fresh plugs I've bought for it. Do you think the wooliness when cold is caused by of of the old ones being barely finger-tight?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanerno1 Posted October 13, 2012 Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 OK, for some reason I didn't even touch the temp sender (and so far I've not checked the fan), that's a job for another day. Instead I got distracted by the fresh plugs I've bought for it. Do you think the wooliness when cold is caused by of of the old ones being barely finger-tight?! Loz the carbs aren't all that to do buddy, if the plugs were loose then maybe the carbs are too, or full of gunk etc,, out if interest at what revs are you getting "wooly" feeling? And what can have you got in it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudgetBoy Posted October 13, 2012 Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 OK, for some reason I didn't even touch the temp sender (and so far I've not checked the fan), that's a job for another day. Instead I got distracted by the fresh plugs I've bought for it. Do you think the wooliness when cold is caused by of of the old ones being barely finger-tight?! Finger tight,, thats not too good mate.. Torque them up properly.Certainly wont be helping matters.. do the other stuff first and see how it goes then mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 It feels wooly about 6k, then clears and pulls OK. It's got a scorpion can with an adaptor thing on it but no baffle. I'm going to have a wrestle with the carbs some point, at least clean them up, put it back to normal but with a clip up on the needles I guess for the can. I might also invest in some new carb rubbers, hopefully it'll be less of a pain to get them on then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanerno1 Posted October 13, 2012 Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 5.5k is the can mate, they have a awful flat spot there as standard, add a free flowing can and its made so much worse, needle/jetting it te answer but stock nc30 needles are not adjustable... Give rick Oliver a shout for some nice carb add ons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMSMJ1 Posted October 13, 2012 Report Share Posted October 13, 2012 buy some RVF rubbers too - they have a nice taper and make is so much easier to refit to the bike. it sounds like a nice moto. Are the rubber flaps all in place too? - bits under the carbs and tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 Nice tip about the rvf rubbers, cheers. I don't know about rubber flaps, sounds like something that doll I used to keep under the bed had. Under the tanks there's nothing other than the airbox etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMSMJ1 Posted October 14, 2012 Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 there are flaps that attach to the cross frame beam jobbie - dumb people remove them thinking that it will let more air in and go faster innit.. It just cocks the fuelling up a bit. they clip to the beam and it drapes itself onto the front head. will be obvious to a man of your rubber knowledge if it is missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 If it's not there I'll replace it with the bit I cut out of the arse on my latex keks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMSMJ1 Posted October 14, 2012 Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 I thought you bought them bumless ones from a proper shop..not DIY? Bloody good work if not, shows your spotty ringpiece off lovely.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorenzo Posted October 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 LOZ,, just had a thought.. are you sure you dont have a faulty temp switch? often overlooked.. http://www.wemoto.co...perature_Gauge/ So, I rode back form work and thought to myself "while it's obviously warm, I'll check what the temp sensor is saying in comparison to the book". It was at 60ohm, where ti should've been more like 30ohm. New sensor ordered, let's see if it fixes it. The neutral sensor's started playing up again too, so I ordered another of those while I was at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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