Painting in the cold

[lorenzo]

I'm setting about giving the back end of the mighty srad a coat of paint, it's grubby fibreglass gelcoat at the moment, I've given it a splattering of filler in all of its many little nicks and scrapes and shortly it'll be needing a coat or two of paint. However, somewhere in the reccesses of my slight knowledge of painting something tells me that it's not good form to be painting in cold weather. What will happen? I'm going to be paiting in the garage, it's not got much in the way of heating, just a little fan heater, so it's only ever a couple of degrees warmer than outside, so probably somewhere about freezing, you can certainly see your breath in there. Anybody got any tips, other than the obvious, which is to leave it 4 months?

While people are imparting their knowledge, this is the first time I'm going to be painting solo in my own garage, as opposed to round at thefatmans, so I don't have a helping and experienced hand to help me out when I spray my own eyeballs etc, any tips in general? I'm just going to be doing the tail in plain white with a bit of laquer too.

[Timbo S2]

I've prepped my srad fairings for paint also, though will have to wait until it gets warmer as I'll be painting in an old warehouse...

Currently painting my bike lift, and that takes 2 days to get touch dry...

[scrappy600]

if you can see your breath its generally not a good idea to be spraying as theres too much moisture in the air. But if you must, get the heaters in and raise the temps as much as you can for as long as you can, wet the floor, keeps the dust down...........pop the panels in front of the fan heater before painting and get them warmed for taking paint. If using a compresser i always found 48 psi to be the magic number for spraying body panels.....and tack rags are your friends!!

[TheGoat]

My mum had a chips away guy out a couple of weeks back to fix a small scratch on her motor. The guy was there for 8 hours because when he went to "flatten" the lacquer, it all came off. He deduced that this was cuz of the seriously cold weather and set about giving it another go.

Same again.

Eventually he just gave up and said... "see how it looks in a couple of days, and ill be back to finish it when the weather warms up a bit"

Needles to say... it looks shit. Lucky for her it's guaranteed, and will get fixed properly as promised.

So, in summary: Don't paint in this weather unless its enclosed with a decent ambient temperature. It wont work and will look shit.

HTH.

[speedy sie]

if useing 2k paint.....acselarater is your friend.

add as required and the paint will flash of quicker,iv painted bikes in 10c no problem....

but there is a bit more to it than that,but to be honest i carnt be bothered to write it a s there are just to meny big words used...sorry.

ideal heat for 2k paint is 24/32c and a flash of time of about 15 mins,then bake at 70 pluss for 50mins and above.

you can speed all the paints up incuding the base coats with add in acselartsers,but this can mat the liquer a bit.

using a hot air gun is a no..no..

heating the panel up is a yes,yes.

light coats is a must,and expect it to run!!..if over done..

[addiction269]

i tried this a couple of years ago,nice and simple gloss black i thought! nope couldnt get a decent shine even tried laquer and using it in a heated shed but was shit,id say youd be fine getting your primer on and a quick colour over spray to flatten down on

[Boozybloke]

Paint? Why not see one of those nice boys that advertise on here for a vinyl...

[kaighn80]

ive painted in the workshop without any warmth, its all in the preperation i basically heated the panels i was painting before the paint was applied, not the best of finishes but ive had worse, if its rattle can then i would defo warm the panel, or you could do the otherthing i sometimes do, paint it in the kitchen, last time round was a hardtail chopper frame and i had the misses mixing the paint for me (she's the bollox of a partner)

[lorenzo]

I'll be using 2k paint and with a bit of luck te weather's due to warm up later this week so I might just leave it a few days. I've spent today sanding it back and realised that there's millions of tiny little dinks all over it so I've been splodging a bit of stopper in there, so tomorrow it'll get its final sanding and then maybe the primer, colour coat and laquer maybe thursday, then I'll give it a good bit of time to sure, then those 01racefx boys can have their merry way with the bike in the new year (not a full wrap, not needed). I'll let you all see how the painting went on once it's done...

[lorenzo]

2-pack paint is proper nasty stuff (the hardener contains isocyanate). Don't touch it if you have asthma. It should really be only used if you have an air-fed mask TBH.

Pah, death shmeth. I've got a pukka mask which is designed for 2k paint, not air fed, but it's got a special filter that only lasts a certain amount of time, it's the real deal, I'll be fine.

[lorenzo]

Well, frankly, that was wank.

I knew I was at risk of getting runs (urrr) so I set the gun to be spraying minimum amount of paint, a very fine mist that was visable on the tail when I sprayed it but would've needed a fair few coats to get any decent coverage, I'd got my little polythene booth set up, I had both the heaters on in there, it was I guess about 8 degC in there, which I don't think is especially cold, and I sprayed and it ran like fuck, everywhere there was paint there was runs. The whole thing is shit, I'm going to have to start from scratch more or less, there's runs all over it. Lesson to all would-be painters out there: it's too fucking cold, go in and have a cup of tea instead.

[speedy sie]

dear sir a helpfull hint on painting...

1,first coat very light wait till it is almost tackey to toch,finger on pull back you sould have it cobweb to your finger,this is the grip coat.

2,second coat agine light,same agine with the finger.

3,third medium cover coat this sould then give you the finish.

no runs.

the thing with runns is you must get to the point when the next coat will stick,not run off.at 8c it could be up to 3/4hr between coats and up to 1 1/2hrs.

we have had 2k paint mixxed up and stood for 24 hours and still fuiled due to the cold.

at work they have been painting full pick up bodies at 10c no problem.

hope this helps.

[drunkn munky]

Im no paint expert but ive been painting in a 8x6 shed with poly lined walls, i have a one of those electric oil filled rads in there which keeps it pretty warm and i havent had a single issue with runs. Thats using 2k paint.

Dont wanna tell you how to suck eggs but the best advice i was given was get a decent gun, i struggled for ages with suspect finishes and runs as i was using some unbranded gun i picked up cheap to get me started. Since brought a devilbliss SRI mini toploader, havent had a bad day painting since.

[speedy sie]

sri top gun

[hipringle]

Well, frankly, that was wank.

I knew I was at risk of getting runs (urrr) so I set the gun to be spraying minimum amount of paint, a very fine mist that was visable on the tail when I sprayed it but would've needed a fair few coats to get any decent coverage, I'd got my little polythene booth set up, I had both the heaters on in there, it was I guess about 8 degC in there, which I don't think is especially cold, and I sprayed and it ran like fuck, everywhere there was paint there was runs. The whole thing is shit, I'm going to have to start from scratch more or less, there's runs all over it. Lesson to all would-be painters out there: it's too fucking cold, go in and have a cup of tea instead.

I,m absolutley gutted for you, I feel like shit now it hasnt turned out right. Is there anything I can do except laugh me freeking head off for a couple of minutes?

Epic fail really, stick to watercolours ugly no actually rub it all down & try again (& dont u dare ask Tim for help),

Dont forget to post on here, pics would be great too....

[lorenzo]

Mr Hipringle. I am going to paint your ugly fucking head. Cunt.

[hipringle]

Mr Hipringle. I am going to paint your ugly fucking head. Cunt.

I,m sure you,d get it wrong.

[lorenzo]

You've clearly got it wrong in the past, put the air hose up your arse I assume, maybe that's why you're all a bit inflated looking.

[lorenzo]

Right, rubbed it back and had another go today with much better results, although things still weren't perfect. I turned the paint right down, there's hardly any coming out at a time now, literally a light mist, so i have to go back over the same spot maybe 4 or 5 sweeps to get any real degree solidness to the coverage, but then what happens (and this has only happened in 2 places so I'm clearly getting a bit closer to the desired result) is that a big slab about an inch wide of primer will sort of slide away and drop, looking like a bit of an avalanche if you get what I mean. What's causing that and how do I cure it?

Also, while I'm picking peoples brains about these sorts of things, what sort of thickness sould I be aiming for with my primer? When I was round painting at thefatmans a few years back he explained the consistancy by the amount of time it took to dribble off the stirrer, but at the moment I'm working on a mix ratio of 50/50. I guess that the thickness of the paint will vary with temperature and hence I'd be better aiming for a specific consistancy rather than just a mix ratio? What should I be aiming for do you think?

Also, the gun I'm using has a couple of knobs on it, the one on the back which adjusts how much paint comes out, which I think I'm getting the hang of, and then one on the side which I think is the amount of air (well what else is there?). What sort of level should this be at and what will incorrect adjustment of this cause?

Finally, I'm preparing the bodywork with some 300ish (I think it's 320, but can't remember) grit wet and dry. Is this OK? It seems to be getting a decent smooth finish but is this too fine/coarse for the primer stage?

[scrappy600]

Right, rubbed it back and had another go today with much better results, although things still weren't perfect. I turned the paint right down, there's hardly any coming out at a time now, literally a light mist, so i have to go back over the same spot maybe 4 or 5 sweeps to get any real degree solidness to the coverage, but then what happens (and this has only happened in 2 places so I'm clearly getting a bit closer to the desired result) is that a big slab about an inch wide of primer will sort of slide away and drop, looking like a bit of an avalanche if you get what I mean. What's causing that and how do I cure it?

Also, while I'm picking peoples brains about these sorts of things, what sort of thickness sould I be aiming for with my primer? When I was round painting at thefatmans a few years back he explained the consistancy by the amount of time it took to dribble off the stirrer, but at the moment I'm working on a mix ratio of 50/50. I guess that the thickness of the paint will vary with temperature and hence I'd be better aiming for a specific consistancy rather than just a mix ratio? What should I be aiming for do you think?

Also, the gun I'm using has a couple of knobs on it, the one on the back which adjusts how much paint comes out, which I think I'm getting the hang of, and then one on the side which I think is the amount of air (well what else is there?). What sort of level should this be at and what will incorrect adjustment of this cause?

Finally, I'm preparing the bodywork with some 300ish (I think it's 320, but can't remember) grit wet and dry. Is this OK? It seems to be getting a decent smooth finish but is this too fine/coarse for the primer stage?

I'm no pro - but

I've always used the theory that it should be the same consistency as milk, put a ruler/stirrer in and watch how it runs off when you lift it out, should be the consistency of milk as it falls, enough to get a proper stream down off the stirrer but not so weak as to come off in drips if you know what i mean.....

What kind of distance are you spraying from? if youre getting hardly any paint out you might be concentrating it in one area too long just to get coverage and thats why youre gettin build up thats falling? You'd be better of with a normal amount of paint from the nozzle, stand further back and move the gun faster, youre making life hard for yourself bringing it down to a mist.

Again im not a pro sprayer but between rally cars, national hot rods and road cars ive sprayed/filled/glassed my share of bumpers and the principle remains the same. This is just how i would approach it anyway.

[lorenzo]

Getting a decent distance is a bit tricky to be honest, I'm using a big sheet of polythene held onto the rafters in the garage with drawing pins, but I think I'm still managing to keep a fairly steady 12" away. I think I'm not too far off in terms of consistancy either, it'll run off in a steady stream for about 4 seconds off the end of the stirrer.

Anyway, I've just been out to examine this afternoons work, and it all looked to have dried off OK, so I sat down and sanded the couple of runs, most of it looked pretty good but obviously you end up sanding a big patch all round the run itself, then I dried it and went over it again with another coat and although there's no runs in it now (I think I'm getting a bit better at it) it's shown up the bit where the previous owner had been at it with the filler and I hadn't done a good enough job on the sanding before hand. Which then brings me onto the next question: I've got a little tube of stopper here, is this OK going onto primer or will I have to rub it right back to the fibreglass, fill it (literally it's just a surface smear that it's going to need), then have a go with the primer again on that bit?

I've also had a look at the gun I'm using. I know it's a cheapo one, it's one that thefatman lent me to see if I could get it to work with emulsion so I could paint the garage walls so I know it's not going to be a posh one, but it's got 1.7 on the nozzle, which I guess means it's 1.7mm. Is this a decent size for doing what I want to do, or is it too big/small? Is there one size that's ideal for primer and another one for paint and laquer? I might have a look at what ebay can offer me...

As you canprobably see, I'm learning from more or less scratch here, and hence I'm really appreciative of any advice you can give me. Certainly from what I've learnt so far, both off here and also from just trying it myself, it's made a massive difference, I started with a tail unit with about 3 different shades of paint on it from the previous owner, yesterday morning it was lovely and smooth sanded (well, mainly), yesterday evening I had a tail unit that was a mess of runs and splodges, and now this afternoon I've ended up with something that is all one colour, is probably about 90% ready for a top coat. It's just a shame it's not a bit warmer so the time between coats didn't have to be so long. Keep feeding me info and I'll keep learning. Thanks very much fellers.

[alexp5]

Loz, it might be worth your while to read through this tutorial.

HTH

[lorenzo]

Great page, loads of info, thanks mate.