Basil Posted April 7, 2010 Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 Lordy Lorks that's some saving, have you tried those oil less fork cartridge kits out yet i forget who makes them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 Lordy Lorks that's some saving, have you tried those oil less fork cartridge kits out yet i forget who makes them... Are these a new thing or do you mean QAT forks? Edit to add just looked up and they are air-sprung, with oil damping. So ignore me. I think either one would push me over any budget I think I am sticking too...... The Kawasaki forks are good and I can if I want fit a piston kit and alter the shim stacks if I need to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonesy Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 The small 6 piston calipers are 580grams with pads and the stock 4 piston calipers are 1140grams each with pads. So just from the calipers that would be 1120 grams weight saving. The narrow pad track discs would save about another Kilo or so.... which is about the same unsprung weight loss as mag wheels... IF I got wheels as well... the front end would possibly lose over 4kg alone. I know I can save over 1.5 kg with the rear caliper and disc. As for over kill the small calipers were designed for 125cc and 250cc GP bikes and on the GSXR they are about at their limit when pushed hard. The rear caliper is purely about weight loss as it has only just enough power to get my R1 through an MOT! Those are pretty impressive weight loss figures for the calipers. Would that have the same effect as losing mass from the wheels or would they help in as much as it means the forks have less weight to control? Unsprung mass makes my head hurt. Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 Those are pretty impressive weight loss figures for the calipers. Would that have the same effect as losing mass from the wheels or would they help in as much as it means the forks have less weight to control? Unsprung mass makes my head hurt. Lee As a simple way of looking at it there are two things to look at with wheels and unsprung weight... One is just the weight and the usual unsprung savings. 1kg is equivelent to 1kg not 6 or 8.... It is the same as sprung weight but it gives the suspension an easier time but not so much to actually alter the suspension settings.. Just makes it very slightly more controlled. The second is the moment of inertia which has an effect on acceleration. The lighter the rim of the wheel and any weight saving fron using a lighter weight tyre will be like adding more power. It spins up easier and the difference in acceleration would be like losing several times that amount on another part of the bike. This is what people talk about when looking at light weight wheels, not the unsprung weight. Finally two pics of the forks. One with the stock Kawasaki caliper and one with the ISR caliper. The ISR has several benafits as the weight and Moment of inertia can be reduced with a 5mm loss on the OD of the disc also about another 5mm on the inner diameter of the disk as well as quite a lot of weight loss in the carrier.If you look carfully you can see there is a gap under the caliper and the disc is resting on the OD of the disc.... so even with the stock 280mm discs I would need spacers.... So if I need discs may as well go and make them genuine 250GP sizes..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonesy Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 As a simple way of looking at it there are two things to look at with wheels and unsprung weight... One is just the weight and the usual unsprung savings. 1kg is equivelent to 1kg not 6 or 8.... It is the same as sprung weight but it gives the suspension an easier time but not so much to actually alter the suspension settings.. Just makes it very slightly more controlled. The second is the moment of inertia which has an effect on acceleration. The lighter the rim of the wheel and any weight saving fron using a lighter weight tyre will be like adding more power. It spins up easier and the difference in acceleration would be like losing several times that amount on another part of the bike. This is what people talk about when looking at light weight wheels, not the unsprung weight. Finally two pics of the forks. One with the stock Kawasaki caliper and one with the ISR caliper. The ISR has several benafits as the weight and Moment of inertia can be reduced with a 5mm loss on the OD of the disc also about another 5mm on the inner diameter of the disk as well as quite a lot of weight loss in the carrier.If you look carfully you can see there is a gap under the caliper and the disc is resting on the OD of the disc.... so even with the stock 280mm discs I would need spacers.... So if I need discs may as well go and make them genuine 250GP sizes..... Thanks for that, I'm not sure I follow about your new discs though. Do you mean they'll have a smaller swept area but larger diameter, while being significantly lighter? With the obvious gains of allowing the wheel to accelerate and slow faster. Also does what your saying mean that the lighter calipers wont have quite such a pronounced effect on performance as lighter discs? Sorry for being a thicko! Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 Thanks for that, I'm not sure I follow about your new discs though. Do you mean they'll have a smaller swept area but larger diameter, while being significantly lighter? With the obvious gains of allowing the wheel to accelerate and slow faster. Also does what your saying mean that the lighter calipers wont have quite such a pronounced effect on performance as lighter discs? Sorry for being a thicko! Lee OK... The 6 piston calipers have a large pad surface area and 12 leading edges to the pads not the usual 4 or 8. So there is a bit more initial bite to the brakes. Also the performance would be close to the stock 280mm discs used on the much heavier Kawasaki and for a bike which would be about 110KG ready to ride over the claimed 161KG dry (closer to 195KG+ wet) for the Kawasaki So they should strong enough with the benefits of the light weight discs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2010 Well I have now ordered the exhausts, and the guy who has bought my old ones has also now bought the full set of bodywork. So hopefully next week I will have the pipes fitted up and have the bodywork, ses clockmount and clip on's ordered too.. As soon as I have all the bits here, I will get stuck into the bike and try and get it ridable in a week or so. Just a few bits to get made like a simple subframe, steering stem and possibly side fairing mounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashgordon69 Posted April 11, 2010 Report Share Posted April 11, 2010 The small 6 piston calipers are 580grams with pads and the stock 4 piston calipers are 1140grams each with pads. So just from the calipers that would be 1120 grams weight saving. The narrow pad track discs would save about another Kilo or so.... which is about the same unsprung weight loss as mag wheels... IF I got wheels as well... the front end would possibly lose over 4kg alone. I know I can save over 1.5 kg with the rear caliper and disc. As for over kill the small calipers were designed for 125cc and 250cc GP bikes and on the GSXR they are about at their limit when pushed hard. The rear caliper is purely about weight loss as it has only just enough power to get my R1 through an MOT! Hello mate, like the bike Just curious about this rear brake caliper that only just passes a MOT on your R1 What sort is it? What disk are you using it on? Pictures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 Hello mate, like the bike Just curious about this rear brake caliper that only just passes a MOT on your R1 What sort is it? What disk are you using it on? Pictures? Here you go..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 Just took the bike for an MOT.. So now the work can begin. Latest parts to arrive...... Hope to have these fitted and tested on bike tonight... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobert23 Posted April 15, 2010 Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 Here you go..... Mmm.. nicely (and it works as well??) Anything's gotta be better than the stock set-up (which suffers the same woes as the RSV, btw) Will you be making more (eventually)? G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 Mmm.. nicely (and it works as well??) Anything's gotta be better than the stock set-up (which suffers the same woes as the RSV, btw) Will you be making more (eventually)? G If this works and looks nice I think I will sort a rear brake kit to fit the bike yes. I would like to try and make a full kit to convert RS250's into the project bike too.. So may look at sorting out every part I use or have made into a kit or do conversions on other RS250's. I hope this project will cost me less than £2000 including buying the bike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZXRRDave Posted April 15, 2010 Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 I hope this project will cost me less than £2000 including buying the bike. Very nice. I'd probably go for a build of this type too if I could do it that cheaply. Is this a reaction to the vast cost of that ugly lump you have been working on for that customer for so long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon Posted April 15, 2010 Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 everytime i see that bike in mcn, i keep trying to work out what went into the design of that bike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2010 everytime i see that bike in mcn, i keep trying to work out what went into the design of that bike Nothing.... just an idea the owner had and then wanted to build it without knowing were anything would go... the body work was done before the rest of the bike... should have been done after the bike was built as a running base and then get it to the design they want.... But like much of the bike it has been done backwards.... But it pays the bills....... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobert23 Posted April 16, 2010 Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 If this works and looks nice I think I will sort a rear brake kit to fit the bike yes. Well, depending on the cost (I don't imagine that the ISR parts are cheap), then I'd be interested The market for RS250 bits is a lil' quiet at the moment, but I'm sure 'kit' bolt-ons and upgrades will appeal to a lot of owners... I would like to try and make a full kit to convert RS250's into the project bike too.. So may look at sorting out every part I use or have made into a kit or do conversions on other RS250's. I hope this project will cost me less than £2000 including buying the bike. What'd be nice is an alternative to Stan Stephens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 Pipes fitted... Now just to give them some testing... Well weather is good so going for a ride on the newly MOT'd and piped bike.... Had a quick spin last night.. bit louder and more over rev but feels better from 7000RPM with the kick still at about 9500RPM. Had to do a bit of rad taping though as it seems to run quite cool at about 50 degrees so not really opened it up too much as I want to keep it closer to 65 degrees. So tonight will be the first real test. Hope to go and collect a fairing from Si. If it fits then the bodywork will be ordered next week and the project begins for real... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heds954 Posted April 16, 2010 Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 ... and the project begins for real... YAYYYYYY!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 YAYYYYYY!!!! Cant wait.... Going to be the quickest project build I have done.. want to do it in 2 to 3 weeks and be out on it at Mallory as soon as possible.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heds954 Posted April 16, 2010 Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 Well, stop loitering on here and get on wiv it den!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 Well, stop loitering on here and get on wiv it den!! Loitering..... Oi!!! Hard at work here...... well. I have just packed up some parts to send out..... well I say parts... Some old bits going to a mate... Well I say mate he is a pain but I get on with him.... well I say get on with him but he is better than most of my mates... Well say better than most... better than Brian who I never really see.... And even then it is a close call.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heds954 Posted April 16, 2010 Report Share Posted April 16, 2010 Yeah, I thought as much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanuki Posted April 19, 2010 Report Share Posted April 19, 2010 more.....dammit!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
si.likes.guiness Posted April 19, 2010 Report Share Posted April 19, 2010 the fairings still waiting for you mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2010 the fairings still waiting for you mate Got to go up to Mansfield today... will call you a bit later.... Thanks.... just been hellish here..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepower Posted April 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2010 more.....dammit!! There will be as soon as I see Si and borrow his RSW fairing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
si.likes.guiness Posted April 19, 2010 Report Share Posted April 19, 2010 you will be happy to know rich picked up the rsw fairing this evening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
si.likes.guiness Posted April 21, 2010 Report Share Posted April 21, 2010 hi rich the fairing looks alright on the prilla,shows the size diference between the nsr and the aprilia though,as it slipped straight onto my sp.tell that loaded fella he can have my prototype fairing for a grand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZXRRDave Posted April 21, 2010 Report Share Posted April 21, 2010 Am I imagining it, or does said "carefully styled, 1/4 million pound bike" already have a seat unit recycled off a Fireblade/CBR6? 675 daytona by the looks of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuntmonkee Posted April 21, 2010 Report Share Posted April 21, 2010 Looks like a daytona to me too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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